vbGore Free Online RPG Engine

We all know the leveling systems we've played in games from the beginning, but what is the theory behind "Levels?"

I'm pulling out the dusty old books for this one... A Long time ago there was RPG games, most notably Dungeons and Dragons (if you've never played or heard of it, goto a major book story and look for it, it's an great idea starter) The concept of leveling was that you learned enough to be trained by a master, or at least someone better then you. Various games use this concept, exp to level -> talk to trainer -> get new skills, stats, and equipment. In DnD when you went for your training it took a few days. Not just *poof*. A concept of Leveling I like is used in WoW crafting. At a certain level you end up having to goto the ends of the world to find your trainer. Now what about a quest based level up? after you get the required xp you talk to your trainer who gives you a quest that when you complete you get your new skills and other level related items.

What about level requirements on items? it usually implies the complexity of the item. I like the stat requirement on items rather then the level requirement. When I get an awesome sword I start bumping all my points into my str to be able to use that sword. But if I needed to be strong enough to use the item... why was I just carrying it around this whole time? Should the player be able to use any item at any time but with a penalty? In DAoC you could wear level 50 Epic equipment at level 1, but the repair cost was beyond what you could afford, plus it degraded much faster. Also you didn't the get the full bonus from it.

An idea for a system I've thought of has stats on a much higher scale. Like start at 5 for everything and each kill gets you a bonus stat depending on how you killed it on a curve the more you go up. capping around 1,000 for a stat all rolls would be made with the stat being a varible with each point representing .1%

I would like to hear some ideas you all have about leveling, and what it's mimicking in real life.

Theres a few level systems out there that deserve their own classifications. Theres the traditional, basic system, you gain a level and get a few stat points to distribute, which is stupid. Theres absolutely no difference in being level 9 with 99% exp and level 9 with 0% exp. Your strength is like stair-steps, not a fluent line. The system I am going for still has levels, but it is more of a Fable-esque style I guess you could say. You spend your experience on stats, rather than your points from leveling. Your level is nothing more then a general representation of how much experience you have in total, and a rough idea of how strong you may be.

Level requirements for items is the worst idea ever. The first person who did that should be shot, and everyone else afterwards who used it should have at least 3 toes smashed with a hammer. It not only makes no sense, but it is just annoying. "Oh, sorry Jimmy, you have 1000 strength and can smash a dragon's skull with your fist, but you must be level 5 to hold this stick." All it does is emphasize the stair-style character power increase.

Strength to use it makes sense in a way. I can pick up a 150lb bar and carry it around, but no way in hell I can swing that damn thing. The single attempt to do so will probably dislocate both my shoulders, break my foot, and I'm sure that, in some comedic way, I will hit my nuts on something. As for using the items at any time - I can't say how that will affect the game itself, but one important thing about items is that as you notice in games, they just look cooler and cooler as time goes on. No one wants to start with an awesome weapon and move down to a stick they swing at people while running around in their potato sack of mystical powers. Even without a paper-dolling system, cooler items are a great way to intrigue someone to continue playing, and to look forward to.

i agree the crafting system in WoW was good in the aspect of traveling to find a new trainer, where they botched it up though was having it tied into your characters level. needing to go out and spend 3 hours killing wolves just so you can become a journeyman whatever didnt make sense to me. the way the profession level up was horrible to, usually involved grinding for a few hours, going to the AH and buying 40 stacks of leather, then crafting a bunch of worthless crap just so you can get the next set of worthless patterns. finding a rare pattern on some vendor in some far off place made it interesting, but the rest of the system sucked.

i think any player should be able to use any item as well, but having a penalty based on skill would definatly be needed. i can pick up a staff, sword, or crossbow with no problem, maybe even be able to do a little damage too (most likely hitting myself in the balls as well) but i wouldnt be able to do anything close to what someone who has experience/training with that weapon can do. level restrictions on items makes almost as little sense as class restrictions.

i've been toying with a skill system for weapons that will give you a slight boost the more you use it. it wont be anything major though since i wont be implementing player levels, and i'm trying to keep everyone on an equal playing field. it will be something like, you pick up a sword, you can do 10 damage with it, after using it for a while you can do 13 damage. so you're not really that much better with it, and there wont be a major grind fest if you want to switch to a different weapon, but it gives you that slight edge that comes with experience.

I think the next time i do a game your level will be based off skill increases.

If you get your 1hand slashing to 50 then you are level 5, if you got your 1h blunt to 30 and your 1h slash to 50 then you are still 5.
Your highest skill determines your level, again just a rough estimate of power. I do like the idea of item requirements though but they are based off your skill with any particular item. If you want to use super_cool_sword_1 which has a 1h slash requirement of 85 and a strength requirement of 50. Stats are purchased with experience gained from killing monsters.

You can buy everything from hit points, mana to int etc etc. the higher that particular stat is the more it costs to raise.

For example maybe at 200hp it costs 10,000 exp to buy 50hp but at 1000hp it costs 20,000 exp to buy more.
Stats like STR,DEX,CON etc always cost the same amount now matter how high they are.

Of course all the "numbers" here were purely just for example and i'd have to see how to balance it all at that time.

I would go with the higher your level the higher your capibility of handling the weapon. Everybody can use the same weapon but by each level, the more complex the way they can use it. Yay. So short and simple.

ComicNin, you've just demonstrated the first rule of Programming!!!!
K.I.S.S.
Keep It Simple Stupid.

The more complex a system gets the more likely that the average user is not going to want to deal with it. That is the reason that I think the level up system has survived for so long. It's also why the skill basied systems or other systems never really seem to work to the full potential. However the Fable Point buy system is outstanding I must say. It broke away form the Level system and dealt with skills and stats on a purely xp based. Every xp point mattered.

I personally like complex systems... to an extend. D&D style games are way too complex, since every decision you make is backed by like 2 pages of text from the start. I think its good to keep it simple at the start, but expand on it as time goes on. That way, any idiot can play, but those who really want to plan their tactics have the room to do so.